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Pornography, Rape and Sexual Assault, Women's Birthing Rights, Women's Bodies, Women's Health

Discussions We Will Not Have Here

I sometimes have read whinings that I do not allow dissenting points of view here.  This is very true.  There are certain “dissenting points of view” which will not find their expression on my blog.  They are as follows:

  • Defenses of pornography.  Defend pornography on your own blog or in any one of the multiplicity of venues available for defenses of pornography.  Here?  No.  This is a radical feminist blog.  I oppose pornography with every fiber of my being, as do most of the women here.
  • Defenses of prostitution as a matter of “choice” or as “empowering”.   You may make these defenses on all sorts of blogs and websites and in the mainstream media.  You will never make those defenses here, on my blog, because those defenses cause deep harm to the thousands and millions of children and women who are forced into prostitution and trafficked as sex slaves throughout the world.  Those defenses aid and abet pimps, procurers, johns, sex traffickers, and the pornography industry.  You will never see them approved or entertained here.  Never.  
  • Defenses of sadomasochism as liberating, empowering, or good, whether it occurs in the course of sexual intimacy of any kind, in “scenes”, in “play parties,” between fundamentalist men and their wives, in marriage, out of marriage, in relationships, in friendships, overt, covert, unapologetic, unrecognized, none of it is going to be defended here.  Sadomasochistic relationships are at the heart of the systems, institutions, mechanisms, dynamics, social orders which have created the world as we know it, teetering on the brink of annihilation.    Whether it is the sadomasochism inherent in war, imperialism, colonialism, conquest, fundamentalisms of all kinds, sexism, racism, classism, lesbophobia, transphobia, abuse of children disguised as “discipline,” abuse of animals, abuse of the planet, seas, mountains, skies, earth, or whether it is sadomasochism in intimate relationships between individuals, all of it, because it is about dominance and subordination,  about some groups subjugating others, harms human beings, creatures, and the earth, it participates in the destruction of beneficent life on the earth, and so I oppose it.  It will not be defended here.  Defend it elsewhere.
  • Defenses of males as oppressed (as males) or accusations that feminists are “sexists” or “misandrists”.  Read.  Study.  Learn which sex, far and away, owns the world’s wealth, runs the world’s corporations, heads the world’s governments, religious organizations, judicial systems, academic institutions.  Learn who rapes and who is raped, who batters and who is battered (and for that you might take a look at Stormy’s link from yesterday).  Learn your history.  I will not be welcoming “dissenting opinions” about men as an oppressed class here on this blog.  You may have that discussion all  over the place, not here.
  • Defenses of Big Pharma, patriarchal medicine, “elective” surgeries and treatments, i.e., cosmetic surgeries, boob jobs, face lifts, liposuction, Botox injections,  and the like, “weight loss” surgeries, c-sections,  removals of nondiseased organs and body parts for any reason.  People will do whatever they will do, that’s up to them, I do not stand in judgment on anyone’s personal decisions or what she has done to herself, or he has done to himself, attempting to survive in this world.  But.  These practices will not be defended here.  Big Pharma and patriarchal medicine are gigantic, rich, greedy, exploitive conglomerates which have caused and continue to cause immeasurable harm and destruction to the planet, to human beings, to animals.  That is what we are going to talk about here. 
  • Defenses of medical or other surgical procedures forced on human beings without their consent, whether it is circumcision, female genital mutilation, surgeries performed on infants and young people born intersex or with “ambiguous” genitalia, the “Ashley Treatment”, or most procedures forced on the mentally ill and those considered disabled.  See above re Big Pharm and patriarchal medicine.
  • Defenses of religious fundamentalism of any type, anywhere in the world.

The above “dissenting points of view” will not receive a welcome on my blog.  Almost anywhere you want to go, read, write, on the internet, mainstream media, television, radio, newspapers, wherever, you can find all the information you want to find, all the discussions you may want to have, on everything listed up there.

While we may discuss the defenses commonly offered for the above in the course of  critique or discussion, I am not going to engage in arguments here with  people who are actively defending practices, ideologies, institutions which hurt human beings, animals or the planet. 




15 thoughts on “Discussions We Will Not Have Here

  1. Thanks for saying this, it helps to make Womenspace feels like a safe place. In the “normal” world, I hear all these women-hating language and view, and is can have a bad effect on my mental welfare. I come to Womensspace to discover that other women want to transforms their communities to end the stream of women-hating.
    On a personal level, I so pleased you will exclude pro-porn and pro-prostitution views. These views cause so pain to women who have forced to view or be part of porn. As an ex-prostitute I don’t come to Womensspace to read other women defending prostitution as a choice or that it can be empowering. These are lies, and deeply silencing to many ex-prostitutes who have become radical feminists.
    Thanks again, for I can get re-traumatized by pro-porners and pro-prostitution.

    Posted by Rebecca | November 29, 2007, 6:27 pm
  2. Glad to see it! There are plenty of other places to find those discussions.

    Posted by thailandchani | November 29, 2007, 7:02 pm
  3. *applause!*

    Posted by witchywoo | November 29, 2007, 8:19 pm
  4. Awimmin!

    Posted by pisaquari | November 29, 2007, 8:47 pm
  5. I too am pleased pro-porners, pro-prostitutors and of course not forgetting those who claim ‘men are the ones oppressed’ will not be allowed to take over and colonise yet another radical feminist website. It’s hard enough as it is constantly reading about ‘violence against women’ wherein the ‘male’ word is never put in front of violence against women. I am also aware constant claims prostitution and porn is empowering to women does cause immense pain and anguish to women survivors who are struggling to deal with the aftermath after having exited porn and/or prostitution. Deniers and excusers can go elsewhere.

    Posted by jennifer drew | November 29, 2007, 8:58 pm
  6. You know, Heart, I think you paint yourself here as far more censoring than you truly are. You do entertain lots of dissenting opinions, including ones that at least mildly accept some of those no-nos on your above list. That’s the beauty of this particular blog — the presence of dissent. So many others are just one set of partisans singing to their own choir. Dissent when it occurs is crushingly ridiculed, scaring off the more timid from voicing contrary views later on. The blog grows shrill and its audience complacent in its hipness. That doesn’t happen here.

    Remember that discussion about fisting? That ended up being pretty educational. You may have been busy editing out a lot of attacks and hostile take-overs during that thread, but to your readers what was shown seemed interesting and challenging without being exploitative. I actually wish you protected your readers a little bit less, but I defer to your judgment on that. You’ve been blogging far longer than I’ve been reading.

    I love the back and forth on this blog between you and commenters and among the commenters. My views have been criticized frequently here. (I probably don’t have rad fem credentials. I don’t even know what radical feminism means.) And while I have despaired at times at the unfounded personal accusations towards me, I have been enlightened by the opinions expressed here challenging my own.

    Censorship, even on blogs, makes me nervous. But the best blogs are the moderated ones, hands down. And it takes a deft hand to find the right balance of dissent versus takeover. From what I’ve seen here, I trust you to continue to do that.

    Posted by twitch | November 29, 2007, 10:34 pm
  7. ah Heart, I love you 😀
    for this and a ton of other reasons

    Posted by Cinder | November 30, 2007, 12:18 am
  8. Thanks for the good words, women. 🙂 Hey, twitch, I’m sorry you’ve had it rough here from time to time. I’ve really appreciated what you’ve had to say and the intelligent and reasonable way you’ve said it. I, too, thought the fisting discussion was interesting and would have liked it to continue. I predict it will come around again for discussion– most things do eventually! Thanks for telling me you think I over-protect, that’s helpful feedback. I’m sure that I do err more to the side of caution at times, probably too much. So much that we say here and elsewhere gets lifted out of context by sexists and anti-feminists and used as a weapon against us, and that’s what’s in my mind a lot of the time as I moderate threads. I’ve found that as radical feminists we have to be *so so* careful– the wrong word, any imprecision or lack of clarity around controversial issues, guaranteed, someone will try to hurt us with it. It’s so unfortunate that we have to be wary and vigilant like that– I hate it.

    Rebecca, I’m so glad this is a place you feel safe and supported. I am a survivor of all sorts of horrible things, though not prostitution, and I know that I, too, am retraumatized and destabilized when I am in the presence, in real life or online, of people who are ignorant or insensitive about the kinds of abuse I have suffered. I can never be around anyone who disputes that the abuse I have suffered happened, who is dismissive or makes any sort of suggestion that it was deserved. This brings up so much for me — very painful. I have been disgusted in the past watching what happens to survivors of prostitution who dare to challenge the pro-prostitution crowd. Anyway, I’m glad you’re here and appreciate all you have to say.

    I love you too, cinder, good to see you! How goes? 🙂



    Posted by womensspace | November 30, 2007, 4:53 am
  9. It all seems sensible to me in the context of radical feminism.

    Thanks for posting a list.

    Posted by Satsuma | November 30, 2007, 5:52 am
  10. Thanks so much. My heart goes out to all the women who have been triggered by the ignorance of the reality of male violence, and how women are meant to react to such trauma. I sorry if I sounded selfish.
    I feel male comes in many forms, but often uses mental abuse as a way to control the woman or girl. Much of the ignorance comes because it is easier to say the the woman or girl is to blame, then to see how she was manipulated to blame herself.
    Pro-porn and pro-prostitution speech is silencing. Like all women or girls who have experienced male violence, women or girls who have exited the sex trade and have enough strength to speak out – will whilst speaking be remembering some horrific events. The dismissive talk of pro-porners and pro-prostitution silences often saying it is a radical feminist lie. Also, saying it is just an indidividual “story”, which is sad but unusual. This is not just hurtful, but is the complete opposite of the reality for most women or girls in the sex trade.
    I am sorry to go on. But I sick and tired of pseudo-feminists defending porn and prostitution. It is important to remember both are outlets for male hatred of all women.

    Posted by Rebecca | November 30, 2007, 8:54 am
  11. Very well said, Heart, and thanks for saying it! 😀 x

    Posted by Debs | November 30, 2007, 9:46 am
  12. Rebecca, never apologize for what you have to say! Your comments are so valuable and true! You are so right that pro-porn, pro-prostitution speech is silencing, in particular to prostituted and once-prostituted women, as is telling a prostituted woman her experiences of degradation and victimization are limited to her, or aren’t true of other prostituted women. That is an abusive thing to say, I believe, because it is another way of telling a woman who is or has been prostituted, who already blames herself or struggles not to blame herself for what she has suffered, that there’s something wrong with her. She’s not like other women, all those prostituted women who are just so liberated and empowered. She is made to be wierd, wrong, messed up, the deviant, all of which is what the pro-porn/pro-prostitution crowd needs her to be.

    Posted by womensspace | November 30, 2007, 5:19 pm
  13. Right on

    Posted by Kiuku | December 2, 2007, 12:58 am
  14. Hi Heart, Hi all,

    Thanks for this!


    Posted by Mary Sunshine | December 5, 2007, 5:35 pm
  15. She lives! 🙂

    Posted by womensspace | December 5, 2007, 5:42 pm

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